Thoughts...

Thoughts...

Postby bornagainpenguin » 28 Feb 2013, 22:16

Just reposting my thoughts from the UbuntuForums post I made....

Going to be replying here since the forums aren't up over there yet. (Also Google has never heard of the distro--have you submitted to Distrowatch in order to get some traction?)

I installed it on my netbook, an aging eeepc 901 which originally came with Xandros and has all its original parts. This netbook has run Ubuntu happily from Hardy 'til Lucid until [url="https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/745148/comments/10"]someone[/url] decided to screw all netbook owners running Ubuntu. By that point I was already beginning to look for alternatives because 'Unity' was clearly not something that fit with my workflow. My installation was from a USB drive using unetbootin to move the iso to the flash drive.

Starting from the flash drive worked fine. The live desktop found all my hardware and after fixing the mouse settings to use the touchpad to click and enabling two finger scroll (a necessity for me as my left button has begun to stop responding, a known hardware defect) I was able to connect to my network and explore the distro. Most things seemed to be exactly as I liked it and I appreciated the software selection chosen as defaults. I decided to back up my current Lucid installation and do the install.

Rebooting to the flash drive produced an error when the command line installer came to configuring the hardware. The installer wanted a firmware file to run the network which is considered to be non-free, a rt2860.bin which it offered to load from removable disk. Assuming this would mean scanning the USB drive I had just used in the live environment I told the installer to scan. It was ultimately unable to find the file. I decided to put off installing until I was able to return to my house and use an ethernet cord to do the install.

Once I returned home, the ethernet cord plugged in I was able to complete the install without issue. The installer even accepted my custom partitioning without a hiccup--something that most installers have a fit over for some reason. (For the curious my partitioning is to make the best of my small SSD drives I have an 4GB SSD and a 16GB SSD. The 16GB is slower than the 4GB drive, so what I do is partition like so:


4GB SSD
/---/4GBs
---/efi 8mbs

16GB
/----swap 1GB
/-------/usr/share 4GB
/---------data 11GB

I mark the OS to not use the swap, except for hibernating purposes and symbolically link between the /data partition the usual /home folders for Downloads, Documents, Music, etc. This allows me to retain the faster SSD for all the configuration files that get written to in /home.)

Once installed while using the network cable, the eeepc booted up and once again after configuring the touchpad was able to connect to my WiFi network without issues. It might be worth investigating whether or not it would be a good idea to use the Ubiquity installer to map the live environment to the disk to bypass hardware issues like this in the future. For me it was a somewhat expected annoyance, I knew immediately when I saw the firmware name what the issue was the non-free firmware and knew the problem would be worked around by installing with a network cable, others might have more issues with their network not being able to use WiFi to do the install.

Once into the desktop I immediately started adding my usual apps and customizing my desktop to my preferences. Mostly this went without issue until I tried to add compiz. It was completely missing from the repositories, trying to add it via Sid repositories completely failed me.

That was a show-stopper enough for me to roll back to my backup rather than fight with it over night. Is it a goal to eventually give us back our compiz and emerald themes? I love the cube and I love showing it off to others as a I move from virtual desktop to virtual desktop. It is still one of the best ways to get people excited about Linux I've ever seen and I do not want to do without it.

I fully intend to give the distro another try in the future when I have more time to play with it and try to get it configured to my preferences but I didn't have enough time last night to fight with it.

Another suggestion, would you be willing to create some documentation for those coming to you from Ubuntu explaining some of the differences between it, Debian and Point Linux. I don't know if your goal is to make Point Linux more like Ubuntu or if your goal is to wean people over to Debian, so possibly this wouldn't matter for you. It would be nice to know where you intend to take things though. Your artwork seems to imply you intend to fork off and create a better Ubuntu than Ubuntu. You have a great chance of doing just that in my opinion!

Speaking of artwork, could I suggest possibly using the Mint forked version of GDM instead of LightDM? It was IMHO just ugly after how nicely everything else looked. A different titlebar theme might be nice also, those seemed like the ugliest parts of a very nice looking default theming. It was especially jarring after how nice the boot screen looked to see the way LightDM looked. Then again when the desktop looked so nice then the default titlebars looked so plain they looked out of place with the rest of the system.


I will be testing again once you announce Compiz has returned.

--bornagainpenguin
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Re: Thoughts...

Postby Pry » 01 Mar 2013, 03:38

bornagainpenguin,
thanks for your answer!

Also Google has never heard of the distro--have you submitted to Distrowatch in order to get some traction?

Yes I have. It gave me lots of visitors. Yet the site is on the second position in Google search for me now. But that's result of bubble search probably.

The installer wanted a firmware file to run the network which is considered to be non-free, a rt2860.bin which it offered to load from removable disk. Assuming this would mean scanning the USB drive I had just used in the live environment I told the installer to scan. It was ultimately unable to find the file.

Thanks for information, I'll investigate it. There'll be 13.02.1 release soon and I hope to fix the problem there.

It might be worth investigating whether or not it would be a good idea to use the Ubiquity installer to map the live environment to the disk to bypass hardware issues like this in the future.

Agree. I really want to move to Ubiquity (or Ubiquity-like installer) in future releases, but one will have to tailor it to Debian, and it's not an easy task.

Mostly this went without issue until I tried to add compiz. It was completely missing from the repositories, trying to add it via Sid repositories completely failed me.

Not sure why but Debian removed the original Compiz from Wheezy repos. But I'm building it's MATE fork (thanks Jasmine Hassan!) for Point Linux, so stay tuned! ;)

Another suggestion, would you be willing to create some documentation for those coming to you from Ubuntu explaining some of the differences between it, Debian and Point Linux.

Of course! But Point Linux 13.02 was mostly a solo project. I'm going to build a team now as it's almost impossible to handle everything alone. So I'm looking forward to see better everything working in a team. It's just a matter of time I think.

Speaking of artwork, could I suggest possibly using the Mint forked version of GDM instead of LightDM?

Well, it's not only artwork that makes you choose DM, right? I'm not satisfied with the LightDM artwork in 13.02 but that means one has to improve theme itself first of all.

A different titlebar theme might be nice also, those seemed like the ugliest parts of a very nice looking default theming.

Well, the Clearlooks titlebar theme is a good old thing, and it does the job. But I do not deny there should be some alternatives though. Just give it a time. It's just a first release.

Hope I have answered all your questions.
Peter Ryzhenkov, Point Linux Lead Developer.
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Re: Thoughts...

Postby cycle_mycle » 01 Mar 2013, 06:19

I spent about 4 or 5 days using "pointlinux-mate-full-13.02-64.iso" on a usb stick and fell in love with it. There was a slight (and I emphasize slight) issue getting it to boot to the installation, so I spent a while just playing around with it and being in contact with Peter about it.

Peter quickly responded and advised to change 'vga=normal' to 'vga=788' after selecting 'Install Point Linux' and pressing Tab in the boot screen. That got me in to the installation process and I finally got my Point Linux installed and I am enjoying it so much. It was a relatively easy installation, and definitely worth the wait.

I would encourage everyone to give this distro a shot I sincerely think you will be very happy with it. I can't say it enough this is one super-nice distro. My thanks to Peter for having done this work and given us Point Linux.
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Re: Thoughts...

Postby bornagainpenguin » 24 Sep 2013, 00:33

Sorry I've been away for so long. I got hired between the time I posted and now, that took up a lot of my time. Then I had some kind of silly issue with my password, tried to reset it from my phone and got all kinds of screwed up because the forum or something didn't like my phone. Seems to be working now though, so hurray! :lol:

My old box with its decaying version of Ubuntu Lucid finally gave up the ghost and I had to put in an older box which I immediately installed Point Linux on. So far everything's been great but I'm having an issue with the title bars when Compiz is enabled. I have emerald installed but it simply refuses to display the emerald title bars while in Compiz. To make things worse, trying to use Compiz in this state results in the terminal going white in the text area! Of course switching back to Marco makes everything work again but, then I'm back to the boring title bars. Any ideas what's up? I swear all this stuff worked just fine in earlier versions of Ubuntu....so I know it's got to be a software change.

If it matters (it shouldn't but we all know it does) this old P4 Gateway has an older nvidia card using the 96.xx drivers.

Any thoughts on how to get this working? I'm sure it's probably a simple configuration change but I can't for the life of me recall what it might be. This was a retired box after all... All I know is that it's not the Window Decorator plugin because that's enabled--I checked.

Thanks for the amazing Distro!

--bornagainpenguin
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Re: Thoughts...

Postby Pry » 24 Sep 2013, 01:52

Hello, bornagainpenguin!

It's nice to hear from you! :)

Hmmm, probably nVidia drivers. How much RAM do you have on this old box?

So you mean your videocard is not supported by nouveau, the open source nVidia driver that comes out of box.

All I can recommend you so far is to boot the LiveCD, open up terminal and type there:
Code: Select all
glxinfo | grep rendering

if the answer is 'Yes' - please install the pointlinux-compiz emerald packages and then type the following:
Code: Select all
sudo service lightdm stop

and then on the black screen type
Code: Select all
sudo service lightdm start

this will load the desktop with compiz where you can try to enable Emerald.

[quote=bornagainpenguin]I swear all this stuff worked just fine in earlier versions of Ubuntu....[/quote]
Point Linux is not Ubuntu, it's Debian.
Peter Ryzhenkov, Point Linux Lead Developer.
Pry
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